Home   |   About Us   |   GROW: The Book   |   Blog   |   Join Us   |   Shop   |   Forum Rules

Masks mandatory for all? Is this right? — The Grow Network Community
Pain is inevitable. Suffering is optional.

- Haruki Murakami

Masks mandatory for all? Is this right?

LaurieLovesLearningLaurieLovesLearning ModeratorManitoba, Canada 🍁 zone 3, PrairiesPosts: 3,076 admin
edited October 26 in COVID-19/Coronavirus

I have to preface this by stating that this was in response to a local post about making masks mandatory. I don't want this to be turned into a bash-fest, but need to get this off my chest. This why it is in the Personal Journals section & not Covid.

There is no need for mandatory masks here at the moment, but some have been panicky from the start and have gotten more bold and loud as time went on. These people are either scared or like control, and are pushing hard.

The post that triggered this below response equated not wearing a mask to equal an anti-vaccer. You know, not having choice...and especially being forced into something when it is not a good idea for some individuals (yep, just bowl them over), and not a choice to not wear one, just burns me.

This is my response. It is a rant, yes, but in my greater community, it needs to keep being repeated due to the hate expressed by so many. ☹

I am one who cannot have even a thin sheet over my face. I have tried even that. I panic and it is a horrible experience. I have read that this response could very well be due to PTSD, and I may have been able to link this to a situation in which I was under water & could not breathe. I was also in panic mode at that time due to a kid doing a cannonball & suddenly landing directly on top of my head as I started upward. It was startling & also traumatizing, as I never put my face under water again.

Okay, here it is...

"Hold on. That attitude is extreme & hate inducing. It is very discriminatory in its very foundation.

There are people who cannot wear masks, just like there are some who cannot have vaccines. I can't stress this enough. Both are well known facts, and in the case of mask wearing, some of those would wear a mask if they could. DO NOT FORGET ABOUT THEM. What if this person was YOU? (I am not yelling, but I could not italicize at the moment for some reason) Just because it isn't your reality, doesn't mean they are less than you or don't care about others. That is a horrible assumption & an insult to their character.

This assumption & judgement on those individuals would certainly make them targets of vigilantes who don't know the individual's particular situation, which they legally shouldn't have to reveal to others if it is a medical/mental health condition. Also, to tell those people to stay home, just because they cannot wear a mask, is just not right. There may be situations where they have to go out. What then? They cannot stay inside and be excluded from everyone else indefinitely. That is not good for anyone's mental health.

Case in point, I know of a man who recently committed suicide due to not being able to leave his home & interact with others, nor work with others, due to lengthy lockdowns in another country. This is a real thing. Many countries have seen & will be seeing more of this as all these measures keep going. Given the current hostility I have already heard about in (*my closest city*) & elsewhere toward someone not wearing a mask (whether mandated or not), this could easily become a very dangerous situation for some. It baffles me that with all the talk of mental health, that this is no longer important in society.

Some have listened, but many are still ignoring.

I will continue to speak up for these people, even if others choose to remain silent or others who attack, online or in person, choose to be narrow minded."

Thanks for "listening."

«1

Comments

  • shllnzlshllnzl Southwestern UtahPosts: 1,339 ✭✭✭✭

    I don't intend to get a vaccine, but I wear a mask when shopping. I do not wear a mask when working out at my gym. So far, my city is asking, not mandating that we wear masks.

    The unique circumstances for each individual should be respected. I agree that demands and anger have gone too far. It is okay for a business to set mask wearing rules to enter its facility, but beyond that, these political dictators are going too far by overlooking the unique circumstances of each location (i.e., a lake vs. a shopping area). What we are seeing in the person-to-person fights is emotions out of control.

    It is a tough time for all, and adults need to seek emotional help if they need it. We cannot sustain this lock down effort as it is unnatural. I worry about what this is doing to our children.

    I hope my comments were appropriately respectful.

  • LaurieLovesLearningLaurieLovesLearning Moderator Manitoba, Canada 🍁 zone 3, PrairiesPosts: 3,076 admin

    @shllnzl Yes, they are. Thank you.

  • kbmbillups1kbmbillups1 Posts: 412 ✭✭✭✭

    @shllnzl I don't intend to either.

    @LaurieLovesLearning I know how you feel. There are many people who either cannot or should not be wearing masks. Until about 2 weeks ago when the governor of my state told the mayors etc that they couldn't issue mask mandates b/c they aren't enforceable I had not worn one b/c they give me anxiety. Then, all of the stores made them mandatory. Honestly, a lot of them are letting people in without them but some will not. All that to say I made a face shield out of an old visor and a piece of overheard transparency film I had left from when I used to teach school so I can go in the stores. I hot glued the film to the visor. It is much easier to wear b/c it's not directly on my face. No one has said one thing to me and have let me in all stores. I do agree with you that it should be a personal choice instead though.

    If you're forced to wear something you could be creative and make one of those.

    I also worry about what it's doing to the children. I remember being a very small child, maybe 2 or 3, and my parents going to friends houses who liked to show off their bomb shelters. I remember going down in them scared me and listening to the adults talk was scary too. I'm sure a lot of today's kids will remember feeling the same way and sadly the older they are the less they'll forget.

    I'm so glad my kids are college age. I didn't have to make them do anything and they were able to make up their own minds about what they think about all of it. We've had many, many conversations.

  • dimck421dimck421 Posts: 205 ✭✭✭

    The toll is great, and the toll is real, whether one catches the virus or not. Humans need humans. We need that exchanged smile. Not everyone shows a smile even in their eyes. We need to see the smile. The smile assured us from birth, through all our years. The isolation taxes many in many ways. Unless a mask is required or entry is denied, I skip the mask. I apply lavender oil to my mask, enabling me to tolerate the contraption, for brief periods of time. So odd to think, that, until not so long ago, a mask in public or even a hoodie was illegal, as it hides an identity. Complicated! Hang in there!

  • mgray11mgray11 Seattle, WA 8bPosts: 83 ✭✭✭

    Hugs to you OP. I struggle with PTSD as well and can only imagine if I was told it was mandatory to incorporate my trigger into my daily routine.

    It's mandatory here in Seattle, but I only wear it when there are people around.

    Thanks for a different perspective on this.

  • Gail HGail H Posts: 297 ✭✭✭

    @mgray11 I don't know about the legality of wearing hoodies, but up until recently our bank had a sign on the door that one could not wear hats, sunglasses or hoodies in the bank.

  • dimck421dimck421 Posts: 205 ✭✭✭

    @mgray11 I may have worded it wrong. I am not sure they were "illegal", but in my state, we were not to wear a hoodie up in public places, like banks, stores, and such. Signs were up, as @Gail H mentioned. In short, clothing that could conceal an ID, was not permitted. Forgive the the confusion.

  • Lisa KLisa K Posts: 336 ✭✭✭✭

    Living in California we do not have an option and since I shop for my 87 year old dad I am OK with wearing a mask - in my case it is "better safe than sorry".

    However, as with anything I think there needs to be some consideration for people who cannot wear face coverings whether it be PTSD or breathing issues and the extent of outbreak. In California and the County I live in there are a lot of elderly people because it used to be a retirement community so more precautions need to be taken. In areas where the outbreak is not as bad maybe stores can do things like take temperatures and/or step up cleaning along with distancing to help stop the spread instead of masks?

    @kbmbillups1 and @shllnzl there is another benefit to face shields is that they are see-thru so people who are deaf or hard of hearing can read lips - I saw a story on the news that not being able to read lips was causing issues.

    All I know is that some days I am ok with spending my time at home and other times I so want to get out an be able to hug family & friends!

  • toreytorey Posts: 2,080 admin

    Face shields that clip onto ball caps have been available at some of the Dollar stores in our area. They are very inexpensive and are acceptable at all stores that are mandating face masks. Hopefully they will work for some of the many people that have an issue of some sort with wearing masks. You can breathe easily and there is nothing touching your face directly. And you can still see people smile.

    I sympathise with everyone that cannot wear a mask. I can wear one for short periods but not long enough for an extended shopping trip.

    I have said this in other threads. Masks bring a false sense of security. People seem to think that just because they have a mask on, that they can crowd against other people. We need to keep our distance and be very vigilant about washing our hands. (hand sanitiser is also creating a false sense of security) Many people aren't wearing masks properly or move them up and down to talk. I have seen people touch their faces more with a mask on than without. Defeats the purpose in these cases.

    Stores need to do a better job about social distancing and not letting too many people in a store at any one time. Then there would be less need for masks. I was at a local grocery store last week and it was very busy so there was a line-up to get in. OK, I get that. But why let in family groups of two adults with children? If a store has to limit the number of people in the store, then they should be limiting the number of people shopping as a group. One person, or perhaps two if assistance is needed, should be a bigger priority than masks.

  • LaurieLovesLearningLaurieLovesLearning Moderator Manitoba, Canada 🍁 zone 3, PrairiesPosts: 3,076 admin
    edited August 11

    @torey I was wondering if I might be able to handle a face shield. That would be an inexpensive way to try that. We were looking for diy a bit ago. Would these be in Dollarama or Dollar Tree by chance? I had said that there should be something to attach to a cap visor.

    I agree about the false sense of security. There are so many flaws with both ideas. Soap & water is best & somehow never gets recalls like the hand sanitizer keeps having. 🤔 The crowding is not pleasant and almost seems closer that before people didn't wear any masks? That could just be a skewed perception now though. People are yelling more when they wear masks too, which is not supposed to be good. I know that it is hard to hear others when they wear masks, so people lean in closer too.

    I have participated in the whole family shopping discussion as well. This may work for some, but not all. We are a big family. We have only taken all of them kids into the city twice through this whole mess (and few stores). We will need to do so possibly once more to hopefully find them clothes & shoes that fit. Taking them in a little at a time would take a very long time to complete what we would need to accomplish and we are not in the city often at all.

    That said, parents need to educate their children with respect to respect & rules.

    Anyway, that's a tough one for us to swallow. Sometimes it still needs to happen.

  • KarinKarin New ZealandPosts: 272 ✭✭✭

    Face masks only reduce the likelihood, and depending on what type of mask, how much they reduce the risk. I think a false sense of security is by far the worse, and if wearing a mask makes some people think they are invincible, then that is not good. We know that keeping physically distanced and washing hands with soap are the best preventatives, along with a strong immune system.

    However, if people do need to be out whether its for essential work, groceries or whatever, then a good mask or face shield can help. I like the idea of face shields as they are transparent, especially for those in the deaf community who need to lip read, but they do muffle the voice more than a mask. The Government here is looking at the legality of making mask wearing mandatory here since we have just had 4 new cases confirmed, but I think its better if we stay aware and careful than wear a mask and think everything is ok!

  • seeker.nancy - Central Texasseeker.nancy - Central Texas Posts: 707 ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 12

    Most areas in Texas have mandatory face masks, perhaps even state required? They keep changing things so it's hard to remember. That being said...there is a relatively large percentage of people who will not wear one, seldom having to do with any PTSD or other medical issues. Many stores have a sign requiring them. But there is rarely anyone who can or will refuse entry because of no mask. But social distancing? Few here seem to know the meaning of those words, which might help explain the huge uptick in cases and in deaths. I fully understand there are some who cannot wear masks and that is fine.

    Unfortunately our country is currently beset by divisiveness, and it is often encouraged by some in authority. I am not about that...they can take their drama to their mama (I hope she pops them good lol). Remember...there were ignorant people before COVID - they just show up more now.

  • kbmbillups1kbmbillups1 Posts: 412 ✭✭✭✭
    edited August 12

    @shllnzl I didn't ask if face shields were allowed. I just started wearing it into stores and haven't had the first issue. No one has said a word. Since I made mine it does come around my face farther than the ones I've seen other people wearing. I do have long hair and it covers the sides of mine as well, but I think no one has said anything b/c store want the $$$. I went to a beauty store with my daughter today and almost stayed in the car b/c they have HUGE signs on each door - no entrance without face mask. It is very hot here right now so I decided to give my face shield a try. I went in with no problem.

    Like others have said one good thing about them is that people can see you mouth and I can smile at people. Sometimes I get mean looks while wearing it so I smile back at them. No one has said anything. It's almost like smiling melts away whatever they were going to say.

    I agree with everyone about the false sense of security with masks.

    @Karin I read about what's going there b/c of the 4 new cases. I feel so bad for you guys.

    @seeker.nancy - Central Texas I'm praying every day for unity and an end to the craziness.

  • toreytorey Posts: 2,080 admin

    @LaurieLovesLearning It was Dollarama.

    No offence to families who need to shop. Especially for necessities for kids. It must be even harder for single parents who don't have options.

    I was referring to a situation at a grocery store involving a couple with 3 kids who were not being supervised properly and were touching everything in sight, crowding people and generally getting underfoot. It was quite unfair to the people waiting outside in a line up in the heat. There is a lovely park behind the grocery store and I think one parent could have taken the kids there to run wild instead of the store. Would have allowed 4 paying customers inside. Parents like this make it more difficult for those who don't have other options and who do raise their children to behave in a polite and respectful manner.

  • jodienancarrowjodienancarrow Mid North Coast AustraliaPosts: 655 admin

    I think being a fair and rational person with commonsense prevails. I live in an area with no positive covid infections. I rarely go out and when I do, I'm very concious of social distancing, I do not wear a mask, I sanitize my hands regularly. If the situation altered, then my behavior would. I don't want to be judged and I'm not about to judge anyone else. Interestingly only this morning I was reading an article about why roughly 20% of Australians refuse to wear a mask. 1- Doubt of overall effectiveness. 2- Rebellion against the govt. 3- Scepticism of the severity of the virus. At the moment, there are a few things people can do, especially if you live in a high risk area, wear a mask/face shield if possible. Social distance. Regularly wash / sanitise hands and only go outside of where you live, when you have to. I think people are willing to gamble, which makes it hard to contain. Realistically covid 19 has a 2% death rate, let me put that another way. I have a packet of 100 jelly beans, in that packet are 2 jelly beans that will kill you stone dead by the time you chew them up, right here in front of me. Would you like a jelly bean?

  • LaurieLovesLearningLaurieLovesLearning Moderator Manitoba, Canada 🍁 zone 3, PrairiesPosts: 3,076 admin
    edited August 12

    @torey Thanks. I will check there next time, or get someone to look for me. I hope I have no issues with using one.

    Manitoba is just now recommending businesses in specific areas to require masks. This happens to be the city where we would do shopping in any quantity or get clothing...or cloth to make clothes.

    I agree with you on unruly &/or unsupervised kids. Right now, that has no place in a store.

    I totally am for soap & water (washing hands properly) & I actually don't mind social distancing. I like my space, so have no issues there. lol I have never liked it when people got into my space, actually, unless I feel okay about it. That usually depends on the person & their approach. I know many are not that way, of course.

  • VickiPVickiP Posts: 517 ✭✭✭✭

    I watched a video analysis of face shields and they concluded that the pros out weighed the cons. People don't touch their faces when they wear a shield, it protects your eyes, you can use a straw to drink without removing it and you can communicate with others much better. Does it protect as well as a mask? Usually, especially if you can distance. This was not a scientific study just interviews with Drs and other healthcare providers. One even felt it works pretty well to protect yourself. My husband has started to wear one when he is out and about. They are cheap and reusable. One suggestion was to take a mask with you and if the store insists on one you can have it ready.

  • judsoncarroll4judsoncarroll4 Posts: 2,422 admin

    One thing I have noticed is how much trouble I'm having hearing people in who wear masks. I've been a musician for for around 25 years, shoot guns and had some pretty bad allergic ear inflammation a few years ago - my hearing is not perfect, but not too bad. I had no idea how much I was lip reading!

  • LaurieLovesLearningLaurieLovesLearning Moderator Manitoba, Canada 🍁 zone 3, PrairiesPosts: 3,076 admin

    @judsoncarroll4 No, it is difficult to hear people talk when they are wearing masks, even if your hearing is good.

    @VickiP Thanks for the information. It turns out that even to see a doctor in a walk in, they are requiring masks. That would make it impossible to get an exemption from wearing one if I couldn't wear one to see a doctor in the first place. 🤨 Hopefully I can make a shield work!

  • dipat2005dipat2005 Posts: 244 ✭✭✭

    I have had allergy issues for years to grass, hay and the like and I have been pleasantly surprised that a mask is just the ticket. I laughed one day when a man said, "I really like wearing this mask when I mow my lawn". He said he was surprised at the added benefit of wearing a mask. I am somewhat claustrophobic but because I wore a mask as an LPN I have no problem wearing a mask now. Most masks leave just enough breathing room and a smidge more room for the nose not to feel crowded in the material of the mask. What I don't get is if you are going to wear a mask why would you wear it below your nose. It defeats the purpose of wearing a mask.

  • seeker.nancy - Central Texasseeker.nancy - Central Texas Posts: 707 ✭✭✭✭

    When I lived on the farm I had a lot of area to mow. Since allergies are an issue for me I used a bandanna tied like a mask and it helped greatly! It was hotter but still worth it lol.

  • frogvalleyfrogvalley Posts: 313 ✭✭✭

    @dipat2005 @seeker.nancy - Central Texas The week before the pandemic shut everything down, I was dying from my grass allergies. Our mower was broken and I WAS MISERABLE! The closings started and my friend sent me a mask to wear at school. I tried it on while shopping and forgot to remove it in the car. I forgot to remove it in the house. I forgot that I had allergies. It was amazing!

    I could breathe! I started wearing it everywhere, all the time. The mower got fixed, the grass cut and I continued wearing the mask in the car and everywhere else until the pollen season ended. I don't mind wearing the mask now, but I too have issues with people understanding me when I talk with it on sometimes and I wish I could see their mouths as it is easier to listen and watch their mouths move.

  • stephanie447stephanie447 Ayurvedic Practitioner Annapolis, MDPosts: 177 ✭✭✭

    I'm not making judgments here on the issue of face mask freedom...however, on the PTSD/phobia issue...I found out I had a scorpion phobia when I moved to Texas. I consulted with a local psychotherapist/hypnotherapist who told me the way to get over a phobia was "exposure therapy." In other words, expose yourself to the thing that scares you to get used to it. He would help in part with a hypnosis session.

    So you might try hypnosis (you can find lots of online audios as well as people who probably work over Zoom)...You could also try very short periods of wearing a mask at home to get used to it. Though the face shield is another good option, why not heal the phobia if you can, so you can have a choice?

  • NicoleburbaNicoleburba Posts: 57 ✭✭✭

    Dear people we need to wear a mask to protect others and our selfs and social distance, because the alternative is very likely a ventilator at the best if we are lucky to get one, or a body bag. It is very real, a mask is the easiest we can do so we do not become statistics.

This discussion has been closed.